tv Charlie Rose PBS February 17, 2012 12:00am-1:00am PST
>> charlie: welcome to our program. we begin this evening with a google employee in egypt who used social media to influence a revolution. >> if someone comes in and tells me 13 months ago music will be - mubarak will be out and he will be promise and 7 million egyptians are going to take to the streets and basically vote for parliament members whom actually are going to go to the parliament i would say you need to see a psychiatrist because this is not happening in egypt. but the fact is it happened. >> charlie: we continue with my colleague, jeff gore from cbs who joins me for a conversation with the great race car driver and now announcer darrell waltrip. >> so you had to have a feel for how hard to push that car and how hard to race and there were
times when you really just had to take care of your equipment to make it to the end. that's one of my best, biggest assets is i always finish the race. i learned that from the beginning. i learned that when i owned my own car when i finished the race i didn't eat that weekend. >> charlie: we end with my colleague jeff glor in a conversation with paula treated well written a new biography about general petraeus. >> i wanted to show executives in corporate america, to show young lieutenants going to war, but how to lead your crises. what's leadership on the line look like and how do you communicate your vision. if the traps don't know your vision they doesn't execute the orders. >> charlie: revolution in egypt, nascar racing and general petraeus when we continue.
from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. >> charlie: he was here working as a marketing executive at google when he found himself one of the part of the revolution that ousted egyptian president mubarak after seeing photos of a man who has been beaten to death by a police he launched a facebook page in protest. it has quickly expanded moved into the street and into tahrir square. the rest is history. he's written a book called revolution 2.0, the power of the people is greater than the people in power. i'm pleased to have him here at this table for the first time. we mark the one year anniversary of the revolution and assess that challenge ahead. welcome. >> welcome charlie. >> charlie: it's good to have you here. tell us what you want us to know and why you wrote this book. >> i think that the primary reason was that i was a very apolitical person.
i'm not an activist. i'm having a good job and kids. this whole thing got into me by chance. it wasn't really planned. and my whole experience through the last couple years where you know as an individual overwhelming as an individual. so i thought i had to share this with everyone hoping it will inspire people, would get them to know that they can actually do things that they would have never imaged they could be capable of. and the second reason is because i think this revolution was leaderless revolution. there was not a single point of contact that pretty much got everything in control. in order to write the history of the revolution, everyone had to say behind the scene that are they are experience and then come in and formulate the whole piggure. it was very, the way i wrote it, it was very personal.
i basically set the story a as i as i've seen it. it's not a history book, hoping everyone would understand exactly where i come from, who am i and what happened to me and jail. and finally how did this whole thing happen. because people say oh the facebook page created eat vent but no one knows the exact details of what exactly happened and the motivation of the times. >> charlie: when you were arrested, did they know what they had. did they understand what you had done. >> i don't know until today. when i was, the first, when they got me in, the first thing they said we know everything about you but we just need you to confirm that. i can't see them because i'm blind folded. obviously they are advanced in intarginterrogation techniques. i pretty much told them everything at the end of the day but i don't know did they know or not. i was obviously targeted because i was kidnapped on the streets at almost 1:00 a.m. on the night of the 27th. and taken to state security. so i have no answer to that
question until today. >> charlie: when they released you, what did they say? >> by the time i was, they told me i was going to be released, before that, i was waiting for the unknown. i didn't know when i was going out. >> charlie: fear is deep when you don't know. >> especially if you were blind folded. i did not see anything, i did not hear anything, i do not know what was happening outside. so i was waiting. hours were like days and days were like years until this one time the guard told me the officer needs to speak with you, get up. that was on the 10th day. and he basically told me listen, we've done our investigation and you're going to be out and free. but, and then he started talking to me for hours about the importance of what i say when i come out because the whole media is waiting to listen to me. when i told at that time the brain washing and that lasted for i think over 16 or 17 hours of continuous sessions with various officers whom i didn't
see. >> charlie: where do you think the revolution is today? >> i think that there are two ways to look at things. one is basically to look at the positive side of the story, and we have achieved in one year what we have never thought this could happen. if someone comes in and tells me 13 months ago mubarak is going to be out his son is going to be in principals, no more mubarak government, his party is going to be dissolved and 27 million egyptians are going to take to the streets and basically vote for parliament members whom actually are going to be to the parliament i would say you need to see a psychiatrist because this is not happening in egypt. the fact is it happened. yet there are many other challenges and we have to continue our revolution because it's not complete yet. and there are the first most critical one is the complete transfer of power from the military rule to an elected president. something that needs to happen before i believe writing -- >> charlie: do you have any doubt that that will happen
because the military somehow will not be able in their sense of what's best for egypt, do it. >> so i like to overcome this doubt all the time. i'm going to do what i have to do as someone who loves this country, who wants to see it in a better position and put all the appreciate, put all the energy, be ready for all the sacrifices, not just me, i'm talking about hundreds of thousands of other active egyptians as well. to make sure that this country recovered from the 60 years of military rule. because of that got us somewhere, got us in one of the worst places where egypt should be. egypt is a country hat has been suffering for all these past years, suffering economically, politically while it could be in a much better place. i believe that the amount of pressure everyone is putting now will make sure that it will happy ventionally. >> charlie: here's an appearance you made on 60 minutes. roll tape. >> president obama came out
several times during the revolution, had hinges t things. did it help, did it hurt. >> it's important that he sports the revolution that's a good stand but we don't really need him. i wrote tweet dear u.s. governments, you have been supporting the regime that was oppressing us for 30 years, please don't get involved now. we don't need you. so i don't kno.>> charlie: w and the united states and their response to the revolution. how do you assess it a year later. >> i think i wouldn't change my mind. i think what i said there is the same. i believe that the u.s. has for many years taken the side of its own interests even if it comes at the price of the valves. and i believe that any sorts of intervention not restricted to the u.s. and the egyptian politics is unacceptable to me as an individual. i believe egyptians are the best ones to decide on their faith because it will be based on the
interests of egyptians and that's it. >> charlie: how many face book followers and twitter followers do you have now? >i want to know. it's more than a million. come on. >> the page which i has 1.8 million followers. >> charlie: 1.8 million followers. and what does that mean for you and what does it give you. >> after my identity had been disclosed it means a lot of responsibilities. i kind of feel responsible for whatever i say on the page. i want to make sure that this, i always ask myself before every post is that good for the, you know for the best interest of this country or not. i do not want to abuse a tool like this because at the end of the day it could lead to people dying or it could lead to bringing the government, bringing the country in the rawpg direction. so it's a lot of responsibility. i personally became more
conservative than before. >> charlie: more conservative. >> yes. >> charlie: in what say. >> i mean, i do calculate my steps before taking them. >> charlie: because you can be misunderstood. >> not just misunderstanding because i could lead to doing. i could basically, my actions could result in doing something that is not good for the country. it's a trade off. in the past we're the minority. that's the thing. and before the revolution, basically this was the voice of minority, the voice of the weak the voice that hardly anyone listen to the government ignores and now it's changing with my identity and the other administrators whose identity is released to public. so it's kind of hard thing. but what i'm basically doing is i'm doing my best for this country because i truly love my country and i think that the people of egypt deserve a much better life. >> charlie: when you look at the role of social media, what's your assessment of the role there and the role it will play
in the future. >> so i get a lot of my friends and people i meet in the square asking me like what did social media really do. one thing i wrote the whole book to answer that question. >> charlie: revolution 2.0 is a kind of internet term. >> i don't really mean the internet aspect it's a leaderless revolution, social media played a very critical role in the the january 25 process yet revolution -- >> brought people to the square. >> yes, on 25th. >> charlie: yes, january 25th. >> starting from 28m the revolution was on the street, it was not on the internet. people were using the internet for more information. so i would be biased because i come from a technical background. i work for google and all what i did was social networking. i would say that january 25th, it was critical internet, the event reached over one million people on-line, a hundred
thousand people confirmed it. people were collaborating ideas and what would be done on the street. yet, this is not an internet revolution. this is not a revolution that would never have happened without the internet. it wouldn't have happened because in the most a come hundred years ago there was no even fax machine and revolutions happened. so people do use whatever -- >> charlie: did it accelerate the revolution? >> i think it added a style to it. and it did accelerate it. it would have happened in a different form not necessarily people going on swran 25th because egypt was boiling. there was one thousand strikes mainly by workers who were not happy with their economical conditions. jet what the internet dijet whar banally gave his speech, i was encouraged once the event was published on-line a lot of people started to subscribe to it. so it created this snowball
needed for everyone to go on january 25th. >> charlie: so what about your life now. where do you go, what do you do? what's going to be the life change for you that this has produced? >> i'm missing my privacy. >> charlie: are you really. >> of course. as someone, i did not really -- >> charlie: you don't necessarily desire privacy. i mean you desire some attention to see what you have said about your experiences. >> i think there are two sides of me. one is i wanted really to share the story because i believe it benefits what is important but aside from the book, all of a sudden a lot of life, the media was overblown my role was overblown as well i have to say and that is because media likes to create nice stories. and the story awe mairnltly was nice. currently i'm working with a group of egyptian that just formed a political lobbying group. basically we are trying to connect all people from different political ideologies. we have liberals, leftists.
we decided on working together for transitioning egypt from the tate where istate where it is ne egypt we are all aspiring for and we can't have that unless we deliver our feedback. it's not just about the process or the sit-ins we have to kind of form lobbying group that will communicate with the parliament, the newly elected president to make sure that this happens and the group, in a few weeks now, we have 25,000 members. and we're working on a lot of activities on the ground. and the side that i have passion for which is education, i just started where i'm going to dough mate most of the proceeds of the book and the rest is going to go to the families of the martyrs and the injured people makeally hoping to change the way people learn in egypt. it's through memorization and understandings. i'm hoping the technology to be
part of the campaign to be a change in our country. >> charlie: revolution 2.0, the power of the people is greater than the people in power. thank you, a pleasure. >> thanks. >> charlie: darrell waltrip is here, he is a motor sports legend. 40 years ago he burst on to the nascar scene. he came as a brash and outspoken new comer. he shook up an industry had has not seen his boldness before. he dominated the 198 078s. he won three winston cup titles that decade. for ten years he was been a lead coverage for nascar. he writes that and more and suns will never be the same, racing tragedy and redemption. my life in america's face i was sport. he's the anchor of the sunday edition of the cbs evening news and special correspondent to my program cbs this morning. as you all know i'm a lot busy. from time to time i need help here from my friends and i'm
pleased to have darrell wall trim at thi ----waltrip at thise first time. >> that's how i got my start riding that thing around race tracks in kentucky, illinois indiana. i won over 500 go-cart races. >> charlie: it seems to me that the best drivers always started young. >> well ago-cart believe it or not as innocent as that thing looks, those are 8.2 cubic inch engines on there. they got a couple carburetors, you can see them sticking up on top, burn nitro and alcohol in them. i mean those things that thinking is wicked fast and it's quick and you have to really be good throttle control because you have so much power. and you have to learn how to finesse the wheel. all those things, that pays off when you get older and you can
get into a car. the skills that you learn on that little go cart applies to the big car. and that's why you got a lot of guys. michael schumacher, people like that all started on go-carts because you can do it as a kid. you don't have to have a drivers license. >> charlie: and your instincts and your hand eye coordination and all of those thing. >> it teaches you how to race. >> charlie: this is your wife stephanie nas nascar 1972. >> we've been married 32 years. she's my beufer beautiful red h. i call her red hair. times i thought of giving it trying to make it in the big time and go back to nashville where that picture is ticken won the fair ground there, i won every week i could make a decent living doing that but stevey would never left me quit. she says you're bigger than that. she's my biggest cheerleader. when i get too big for my
britches she's pull me down and when i got on the ground lower than a dog she's lift me up i you have -->> what did she say. >> she would stand behind me. the camera was over there and she would stamped off in the distance and she would be doing this. and shaking her head. but you know, i'm like on a role. i can't stop. i'd get going and it's like the show this morning. you know, i get so enthused, i get so excited and i want to tell you everything, i want to tell you, if you're not thinking like me, you're not thinking right and so that's just the way it always was. >> charlie: what caused you to go out there and announce to the racing press that you were the next richard petty. >> i just feel you had to be confident. you had to have that confidence. do you know what charlie, i
believed it. i believed when i started i didn't have the equipment equal to petty pearson, you're broa and those -- you're boroug yarb. i was ten years younger than most of the guys that time. i had youth and enthusiasm on my side. i was willing to do whatever it took to win, to get to the top. and so when i saw richard petty, he's mine. yarborough, he's mine. and he was determined. he called me jaws. >> charlie: that's right. >> he nick named me jaws. >> was the backlash you got from those saying those things then fuel you. did you use that. >> it did for a while, jeff. i tell you what happens. i just wanted my name mentioned
with theirs. in they were talking about the guys that had a shot of winning the race this weekend, all i wanted was to be in that group. but it was hard to get into that group. it was very closed. there were about five or six drivers that dominated the sport. they owned it and there was no room for an outsider. and i was determined i was going to kick my way in there. only way i could do it first of all i had to get their attention. and so running my mouth. and listen, it wasn't that i talked too much, those other guys didn't talk at all. so i had a huge advantage. i was comfortable in front of the camera. the media liked me. then the fans were look warm. they didn't know whether they liked me or not. i had a huge advantage, i was ten years younger. i knew if i ever got the opportunity, i could dominate the sport. and i finally got that opportunity driving the gatorade car for die guard. when i finally got in junior johnson car number 11 with
mountain do yomountain dew as an the championship both years, dominated the sport from 79 until probably 89. won all the races and was at the top of my game. i knew i could do that. >> charlie: how much of that was do yo due to your associatih you're. >> i won races up to that point. when i went to drive for junior, he was a no nonsense kind of guy. he said look you just do your talking on the track. >> charlie: with your car. >> we don't need you telling everybody how greater. you just so them. that's the way junior was. he would put his arm around me. he was like a father figure to me. and i tell you another thing about junior johnson. when he called me and asked me to drive his car, i was so flattered. it was like, it was the top. i made it to the top. junior johnson wants be to drive his car. and the other thing was i didn't want to disappoint him. when he called me and asked me to drive that car, kill
yarborough just one three consecutive choice i championshn that car. kay law dominated the sport since the 70's. i got to be at least that good. when i got in that car i had a lot of pressure on me. i didn't let it show because i knew i could handle it but a lot of pressure to go out there and get the job done and junior gave me the car to do it with. >> charlie: later you drove for rick aren't districts. >> yes. >> charlie: he said you were the smartest driver he ever knew. what did he mean. >> i don't know what i did. i would, that calculation, i was really calculating about my moves. >> on or off the track. >> well on the track particularly. i knew my limitations and i understood the limitations of my car. see back in the 70's and 80's, you couldn't drive a car. you couldn't go out there and drive it hard, it would blow up or something would break. you had to have a feel for how
hard to push the car and how hard to race. there were times in the race when you really had to kind of take carrie of your equipment to take it to the end. that really was my strong, that was one of my biggest assets is i always finish the race. i learned that from the beginning. i learned that when i owned my own car when i didn't finish the race i didn't eat that weekend. i learned that and applied it as i went down through my career. >> charlie:career. >> so the smartest driver win the race not the motion daring. >> back in the day the smartest driver won most of the races. >> today? >> today you got these young kids. what's so different. he started in 92. he's been in the sport 20 years. i said what's different now and he said they qualify every lap. they run every lap like it's a qualifying lap which means you're as hard as you can go every lap. and in my time, you had to kind of hold back a little bit, save a little bit, like a track runner. you wanted to have a kick.
you wanted to come down at the end of that race, you wanted to have a little something left so you could win. now it's not that way. it's flat out all the time. >> charlie: but you did, you were a runner. >> i was, i was a track star. >> charlie: jimmy johnson does that now. jimmy johnson's very big on endurance. >> these guys have learned nutrition. i was telling jeff, you can always tell the guys are in the best shape because in these long hot races 500 miles, three and-a-half four hours the goes that train, the guys that condition are the one that are still going hard at the end of that race. some of the other guys are starting to whine about their car. oh, it's hot in here, yo-y oh, , oh. >> charlie: he works out three hours a day. >> it's critical. they've got trainers now and cooks and nutritionists sports
psychologists. kyl bush had to goity a sports psychologist. you can figure that out on your own. there have been others that have used to the psychologist 123450eu6789 69 mouth o.>> chars did you feel like somebody was trying to have you spin out and go into a wreck. >> that happened with dale a lot. he was, he liked to rattle your cage, you know. literally. >> like you would be racing with dale and you'd say, and you'd say i got him i been finally got by him and then you look if your mirror and you say why did i do that because now he's going to wear you out bethat's just what he loved to do. he loved to aggravate people. he was such a hard racer. and he was rough. but i was like a surgeon. >> charlie: you ever you wera fine-tuned surgeon. >> i could wreck a guy and made
him feel he did it himself. >> he knew he wrecked it. >> charlie: have you ever wrecked dale? >> we wrecked each other a lot. i can't say i wrecked him. he recollected me more than, i think he came out on the top of that deal. he wrecked in rich mawnld and the all star -- richmond and the all star race. if it's going to keep me from winning he would wreck me. it was going to keep him from winning i would wreck him. >> charlie: you would rather see anybody win but dale you earnheart. >> i think that's a fair statement. when we got on the racetrack we were strong willed as it comes. we were strong-will competitors. >> charlie: is stewart, does he have any of dale earnhart in him. >> he has a lot of aj ford in him. you asked me about indy cars. tony can drive anything. tony is one of those exceptional
talents that can win in an indy car. he can win in a stock car or a midget or dirt track. he can win in an irock race. he can win in anything. that's that talent that some of the drivers back in the 70's ha like aj ford. >> charlie: i what's the talet though. >> the thing under your skin which then can do what dale did, right. >> i always tell people you have it in the seat of your pants. that's where you have it. you got to have a little bit up here but you got to feel it and there are some guys, they get in the car and they can feel that thing's getting loose that thing's pushing and moving around. you feel it. that's your sensor. >> charlie: that's what you had, that's what tony had. >> those two bubble bubbles bace there -- buns back there are your sensor. >> it's like carl lailg bi a li.
>> we went to homestead and i interviewed both of them and tony was, i mean he was wearing carl out talking trash. and carl was like oh my gosh, what am i going to do. i mean he was wringing his hands and you know carl he's a tough guy. he's been on the cover of men's health magazine. he's god a six pack. tony's got a six pack too but he carries hi his with him. two different guys. carl eats at subway and tony eats at burger king. they are just two totally different guys. but carl couldn't handle the pressure that tony put on him and i thought it was fantastic. i mean, tony outperformed carl in the end and he won the championship but carl should have win the championship. he had the best car and best arrange finish in the final ten races and they ended up tied. but because tony won more races, phenowas thtony was the champio.
>> charlie: take me to the daytona 500 and the broadcast there. >> unbelievable day. i was update before the race ever started. stevey and i, i had a race team my whole career i had a team, a hauler, you know. sunday morning you had a routine. he got up, he went to the truck met with the team he talked about strategy for the day. he went to chapel. you came back, you ate lunch and you went to pivot road and you got by your car and your team and you got in a car and went off and raced. well this time none of that. i had no team. my team was up stairs in the tv booth. larry mcronald and mike joy. so our routine was totally different than anything we ever done before. stevey and the girls are lieu -d they're looking at me like dad what are we supposed to do today. we don't have anywhere to go.
i said well i don't know, i got to go, i got to go up stairs. it's a totally different feeling and stevey was sitting there at the breakfast table and say do you think dale would want his scripture today. we boot that on the dash of our car. he did it for dale right up to the day he died. so she was anguishing over we don't have a team, i don't feel comfortable going out on pit road, who am i going to go, what am i going to do. i said well find a scripture and take it out to pit road. she said i don't know if dale will even want me to do that or not. i said honey, i retired, he didn't. he'll be looking for it. so she wrote down proverbs 18:10 the lord is as strong, the righteous will run to it and be safe. that was his scripture for that day. she goes to pit road and dale and teresa are there. dale sees stevey comes over and gives her a hug. she gives him the script choofer
and puts it on the dash of his car like always. that was different for her. i'm up stairs and the race is getting ready to far. we have a lot of practice at daytona. you have shootout, we had qualifying races, we had t saturday racing. so you're in the booth a lot. our boss david hill comes in and he said look here you bunch of knuckleheads. i'm tired of hearing about this and that and something else. he said i don't know who you're talking to maybe you're talking to each other. i want to know why, why are they coming in and why is that passing. why why why. he took a piece of paper, wrote why, slammed it up on the window and left. wow i guess we haven't been telling people why. we better start working on that. so the race starts. it's an awesome race. by now me and mike were hitting on all eight cylinders we're nailing it. i'm making predictions what's going to happen and they're happening.
and we're talking about the strategy, larry is and the pits two tires and four tires in this race. it's a thing of beauty. and we're loving it. we talked about the big one. they probably have a big one sometime toking this race because they always do it in daytona. lo and behold with 30 lapse to go. cars go coming down the back straight away about 18 car pile up so we had the big one just like we said we would. the car just stopped. dale, michael, dale you're running first, second and third. >> charlie: michael's your son. >> my brother. >> charlie: i mean your brother. >> my brother michael. and michael is leading the jail, jr. running second and dale, sr. running third. >> and dale's preventing others. >> at this point, the cars are stopped while they clean up the mess. so dale is talking to the spotters and telling the spotters you tell michael to run the bottom you tell, he's telling them what to do because they've had a meeting that morning and dale had are told michael at the end of this day we're going to come down and we're going to be running first, second and third.
so michael's sitting there, i mean he can't believe that dale said that. and there they sat running first, second and third. so they start to race back and this is when the action really picks up. we're coming to the end of the race and dale, michael's leading, dale, jr. running, sr.- dale, sr. is running defense, running interference. any time somebody gets a run on michael and dale, jr. he would cut them off. i said larry if dale keeps driving like this somebody's going to put him in the fence. i mean that's kind of the talk we have in the booth when we're not amongst ourselves. lo and behold last lap are, white flag. come by, michael leading. michael's never won a race in his life and he's going to win. he's sitting here the chance to win the daytona 500. i'm thinking dale, jr.'s going to pull out and pass him he's going to drag everybody with him. my brother's going to finish 15. that's what i thought.
low and behold he comes off the second turn got a little lead and dale's blobbing and nobody's going to make a run on him and i'm thinking my god i think my brother's going to win this race. as they go in the third turn and michael and dale, jr. come off the turn coming to the checker michael's got it. he's not going to lose this race. dale, jr.'s not going to pass him that's obvious. but in the corner of my eyes they're coming to the line get the flag i see the wrik. i see the black 3 go up the hill and hit the call. i'm thinking my brother. he's won the race. won the daytona 500 and i'm excited man and screaming, crying because my dad had passed away not too long before that and my dad never saw michael win a race. he wins the daytona 500, it's unbelievable. then my focus wait, dale. we do a replay and i thought i was going to throw up because when i saw the car, it goes down in front of the car, hits the apron and when it turns it's
straight back up the track into the outside wall. we don't have safer barriers at this point. that car hit that call probably 160 miles an hour. just like that. and as a former driver, those are the kind that it signals you. your had he goes forward, breaks your brain stem. and so i knew that. so now i'm worried. i wonder if he's okay. ken e administratokenny straigh. he runs around to dale's window. he drops a window net and he jumps back. i knew right then we got trouble. >> charlie: what did he see. >> he saw dale. i mean i don't know i never talked to him. shader there's of funny thing about all of us. we all experienced this but nobody wants to talk about it. charader doesn't want to talk bit. i've been hesitant to talk about what little i know and what
little i was involved in because it was such a, i had such an impact on the sport, on the fans. it was, dale's picture was on the cover of "time" magazine. we only knew, we knew dale as dale earnhart race car driver. dale earnhart was famous all over the world. and people, he was a national hero, an international hero. and it just became so obvious to all of us how huge this was for the sport, for all of us that knew dale. we were all in shock for a week. unbelievable that this man happened lost his life at daytona on the last half of the race. it just was hard to comprehend and the events that followed everything the funeral, the next race. we go to the next race the very next week, bill, jr. wrecks on the third lap going in the third turn hits the wall just like his dad did but on a much slower
racetrack. >> charlie: role tape for a second. this is the final lap of the 2001 daytona 500 as broadcast on fox and darrell is there. here it is. >> big trouble. wreck behind him. to the flag. >> come on mike. >> you got it, you got it, you got it. mikey. >> all right. >> michael waltrip wins. >> all right. >> his treatment come true. dream come true. >> how about that. how about dale, is he okay. >> charader crawled out of his car.
car. >> i guess he's all right isn't he. >> charlie: he wasn't all right. but you went to the hospital. >> yes. just, ... ... i ... i can neveh that and not be emotional about it. michael's wife. everybody's celebrating. michael just won the race in a dei car and dale, jr. runs second. i mean it's a story boobook endg except for one thing. when you see me turn and look up toward the corner, that's when i sashsaw schrader go to the car. when i saw him jump back i knew he had seen something he never
seen before. >> charlie: he never talked to you before it. >> no, he never has. he just kept it to himself. >> charlie: one thing that comes out of this, in which you say it will never be the same, racing tragedy and redemption. so what's the impact of everybody knowing that dale earnhart lost his life that day on the sport. >> well it's been huge because that was a wake up call. we've had a couple other tragedies, adam petty, kenny irwin lost their lives earlier and then dale. and a kid names tony roper so we had four deaths pretty close together all with the same jurors areinjuries, brain stem . so that is car laid th nascar l. they were going to develop a new
car because the car was small and squished down. they were going to develop a new car and make the track safer. they didn't just look at one thing. they didn't just say let's put ice on this guy, that will fix our problem. they went comprehensive and looked at everything. they looked at the race trook that the cars race on. they created the safer barrier they had gotten from tony george at indy car. it cuts the impact down by 60%. they went inside the car. they did tests with dum dummiesd realized that the seats were not built right to protect the driver and his head with a side impact like dale took. they started making seats with the huge headrest and the driver sits in a cocoon almost. y strapped down in there he's got a big headrest. down below he's got leg supports to keep his leagues all in place. they created a capsule for the driver to sit in. and then the car itself was much
safer. the they moved the driver to the right to give some more area over to what the call the crush air yaw so you have more room between the rom cage and the driver. they did everything that they could think of to make the sport ciphesafer so we would never hae this tragedy happen again. no one has died. >> charlie: we had a tragedy here. >> we'll talk about daw don wel. they were pushed to do something like this and it created an awkward situation at times for folks like you more than happy to speak out about it what you thought needed the change. >> of course now i'm in the tv, now i'm a tv -- now i'm an analyst. i'm not a driver anymore so i role had to take my driver hat off. because the driver fraternity, we don't want anybody to tell us what to do. we don't anybody to tell me i got to wear gloves or i got to wear a full face helmet or a
hans device. if i'm not comfortable wearing any of this garb i shouldn't wear it. if you don't make these guys, if you don't make it mandatory they won't do it. so nascar was struggling with that because they never mandated that. safety equipment before. and i was on it. i wanted that hans device because i saw what it would do. and that was one of those things i really pushed hard for and i got. i mean mike hilton and bill france got really upset with me at times but i was determined. i wasn't the only one. listen this book isn't just about dale earnhart. this is a great, this is a lot of great stories in here. there's stuff in there about other thing too but that race that day and what came out it is dale earnhart's legacy. >> charlie: thank you very much.
glad to see you here. molly broad welpaul abroad wellh associate she met general david petraeus in 2006. she began writing a doctoral dissertation on him when he was appointed as u.s. commander of the u.s. forces in afghanistan she turned her project into a book. she traveled regularly to afghanistan and spend time with him and the troops. it is called all in. the education of general david petraeus is cowritten with vernon low. also with me is jeff glor special correspondent. happy to have paula broadwell here at this table, welcome. >> thank you. >> charlie: he has interview general petraeus before as i have and as many journalists
have. tell me about the connection here what you intended to do in the dir dissertation that resuld in the book. >> i wanted to use him as a case study somebody like a maverick within the institution can galvanize institutional change. i wanted to see his specific role to change the counterinsurgency doctrine how he changed the training and equipping of the forces. i proposed to him he would be one of several case studies and he agreed. >> charlie: how is he different. >> i think he's willing to take an idea from anyone whether it's private or someone from the think tank or private sector or press. he's a voracious consumer of information. he does teleskyping. using e-mail for to reach out, he would go on battlefield circulations to meet with young
leunlts and captainleunlts andl. anyone who has a good idea. he was working in iraq at the time could share it with him and he would take those lessons and incorporate them and the organization would adapt. >> charlie: as we know he was thturkarchitect along with the awakening led to some success in iraq. when you looked at that what he did in iraq, he also had a special relationship with george bush. what was it? >> he was pretty close with the president. and he had a frequent contact with him via video teleconference from iraq. in fact the two call each other good personal friends. i think you could juxtapose that with his relationship with this president in that when they first really met, it was then senator obama and petraeus was in iraq. obama as you remember was opposed to that war he called it the war of choice afghanistan's
a war of necessity. they traveled throughout iraq and i think there was tension twin them. you see over the course of several years and we tried to document it in the book that their relationship comes full board to the other side not like his relastship with bush but they're pretty close now and i think the president is excited to have him on his team and you can even call him an obama guy. >guy. >> charlie: it was reported when the president went to meeting there, that there was some tension between the two of them. >> to meet him in iraq. >> charlie: >> right. there was some tension because again i don't think the president, senator obama at the time really believed what we were doing and that the surge could work and was opposed to it. petraeus believed it was working and felt there was evidence and statistics and met triksz to show that what we were doing was showing progress. >> charlie: then he came home. >> petraeus came home. >> charlie: yes. >> he came home from iraq and went to central command after that. this is what he calls his favorite, his best assignment which is really a broadening experience for him even at his
senior rank. central command has 20 different countries and includes a lot of the crises we're looking at right now which prepared him well for afghanistan jobs and really well for the cia job. he's dealing with some of those heads of states, ministers of defense and intelligence officials that he debt with so it was helpful background. >> charlie: pick up the story when stan crystal gets in trouble when he's called by bob gates and joints of chiefs and mike mullens to come to the white. >> the day that the rolling stone article broke stanley mccrystal called pa trifs and he was at an executive board meeting kind of the senior officials in the government who were working on global look at how to do it cooperate tougherly. and it was hosted by director panetta at the time. petraeus received the call and crystal tells him this article's coming out, it's not good. i think you know, there's probably probability that i may be on the way out.
and then admiral mullens calls petraeus the next night and says your name has been throinl in the hat. i don't know if you recall petraeus' name was null really thrown in there. but he knew in the back of his mind that it was an option. so he's driving to the whitehouse for a routine meeting, the national security team on afghanistan and he's sit downstairs and he gets beckened by someone from upstairs to say the president wants to see you in the oval office. he goes upstairs and some of the yearn leaders are coming out secretary gates and so forth. they don't don't have eye contact with him so he pretty much knows the deal is sealed. >> charlie: he did not know he was going to be asked to take over when he went to the whitehouse. >> he did not but he had an idea in his mind that his name was in the hat. it was an option. his hope was that mccrystal would be reinstated, sensitive whitehouse if you will. his fear was if mcchrisal is removed whoever was to replace him could be a great leader but that there would be a loss of momentum. >> charlie:moment.
>> he didn't know afghanistan like he knew iraq and they were vastity different situations. >> that's right jeff. that was an entry position where he had four and-a-half years of experience in iraq. he's quite revered in iraq. i see a lot of e-mail traffic from rieks. rieks -- iraqis. he had more time on the ground with them and he suffered losses with them. for many reasons i think iraq is a little closer to his heart than afghanistan. he felt strongly about he was committed to the goals in afghanistan as well. he still is as we saw in headlines today the cia will maintain a large presence in afghanistan as we begin to pull our troops out. so what he lacked in local knowledge there, he had in obviously the experience he had in iraq of commanding a large scale coalition force. more coalition force members in afghanistan versus iraq. but he had that experience of a command at that level in the
multinational arena. so he was comfortable with that and he hit the ground running. i don't know if he was trying to learn as quickly as he could. he brought an unusual team with him from my perspective in that they were close. they worked where him before but most of them didn't have afghanistan experience. so he brought that close team of his closest advisors but then the rest of the staff there obviously has been with mcchrystal. >> allowed them to see it from a different viewpoint, right. >> i think so. they quickly learned. i don't think it hirnldz his analysis -- hinders his analysis of the operation at all. he knew the commands there, they had worked together in iraq. there were several commands. general rodriguez. when he heard p petraeus' name e said now we're going to win to the staff. the big question is what is winning. in petraeus' mind it was progress and setting conditions. >> charlie: he was not going to be chairman of the joints chiefs a job he might have wished for as sort of the culmination of his military career.
how did he take that. >> he was told by secretary gates in november of 2010 that he was not even being considered. gates had come to check on progress in the war and had been out in the battlefield circulation and he kim back and met with petraeus in his office and said you've exceeded our expectations, you being the force, the progress in the surge but i have bad news. you're not being considered. and it's done. he really felt that he had stepped down. he had been -- >> charlie: he felt earned it. >> he felt he earned it. he thought he should be considered but he hat mixed feelings actually. about this position and he had thought of other positions that he would be interested in the military, specifically the cia. he thought about keeping the uniformer and going to the cia he proposed that right away to secretary gates having liked the idea having served there before. >> charlie: having been cia that's correct. >> right, exactly. and he took it back to the president but the president and petraeus didn't speak about it until march so several months later, five mubles late months . the president said would like
the idea but petraeus would have to take off the uniform. he decided to do that he felt that was the best place for him if he didn't get the chair position. >> charlie: why did he think that. >> he wasn't interested in the chief of staff at the army position or the other position gates office which was supreme allied commander. those had appealed to him earlier but somehow he felt that he, in their prestiges positions he felt he had been there, done that. i think in some sense he was a little frustrated with coalition management even though he's good at it. and he felt that how could nato is not going to change all of these countries are drawing down in their defense budgets. he prides himself on being a war fighter as much as i call him a professor you know. but he really wanted to stay in the arena, and so the cia he felt would be the best place for that. >> charlie: what does he want to do with the cia. >> he lovers it. i think wants to stay there for a long time. he looked at the military as a system as like a clock with you know. i think he looks at the
intelligence community that way and how can we improve our efficiencies. having an everrin been a commanw what drives operations. >> is it improving efficiencies here and there or is it a wholesale change. >> no. he hasn't come in with an intent. my understanding is he didn't con in with an intent to chilly the whole krullure. >> charlie: what is the important thing you learned from him about leadership whether it's a military leader a corporate leader a political leader. >> it's very simple and i'd say that attitude is the most important quality you can have. you're 90% of how things go is your attitude, right. 10% is chance and he really believes that. he's had many hurdles in his life. nobody really thinks that because you look at this guy whose had this mete meteoric ca. people thought he was put out to pasture. at leave leavenworth.
people thought he was being put out to pasture to keep him running for office. he loves it there. he's a professor at heart and there are intellectual cerebrum folks thinking different ways about problems. so yes, he's pretty happy where he's at. >> presidential run. >> you didn't see the john -- show. my husband said i should see it we'll sell more books. he's not going to run for office. >> never. >> he's not interested in politics. he feels he has to yield his principles his values to win in the primaries and he's not willing to do that. >> paula broad well written with vernon lowe. thank you very much. >> thank you. captioning sponsored by rose communications captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org